Littlenymph

Squirrel
Characters
Layla Littlenymph
Platform
PC, Steam
Well how would you balance this with combat.. you would agree of course that this would make crafting so much more superior to finding items then wild drops.
No, in fact, I would not agree with that at all. The key point of my post was in these two sentences;

"The uniformity of crafted gear makes as much sense as the randomness of dropped gear. You can [and should] still combine that uniform crafted gear with the random gear from drops to create unique and powerful items that are superior to that which comes only from drops or crafting."

That is how I would balance crafting and combat. Crafting would give you a uniform result in stats that would generally be superior to that found in drops. I also made no mention of crafting expertise. When you gain the ability to craft a higher tier of gear, this would be the point at which you could introduce a little randomness, so long as that randomness did not diminish the base stats in any manner. It would let me know what I was going to craft, at a minimum, while maintaining a little variety in advanced tiers.

Dropped gear, on the other hand, is where you would find the greater diversity and quality of runes. The best gear would be dropped gear, gnogged onto a base of crafted gear of the same or better tier.
 

Greenwich

Wizard
Platform
PC
I consider it unnecessary, since you can obtain legendary stats by asking a crafter to enhance a tradeable item such as can be obtained from crafting or as a monster drop and two,
Of course but they cannot enhance a soulbound item for you.
True, the scenario above might devalue the souldbound items to a degree, but it does not remove their worth, else why produce dungeon rewards at all.

I believe that it removes one of only two benefits, in terms of gear, that crafting currently provides which combat does not. (Those two things being enhancing and the runes exclusive to crafted gear.)
Anything they put in the game on purpose benefits something most likely else they would not have put it there.. . Some times some things have to change in order to change other things. Especially when it is all tied together.

I'm not saying the changes I propose are the solution. Maybe there is another way.. and maybe it would be too much trouble., But I am saying that I believe enhancement should not lock you in to maxing the same skills multiple times.
 

Anthem

Bog Frog
Platform
PC
How about if enhancements where an account type thing? Say one of your characters could enhance to level 75, they all could. If any one character had max enhance skills all of you characters could enhance to max level. It may be an easier way to do it than changing all the gear. You would still need at least one character with the skill to me able to enhance. This way alts would not need to live in a fully upgraded city to enhance.(As long as the one with the skills did).
 
Reactions: Kaydee and Myst
  • Likex2

Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
Ok, so just let me get this straight - your sole objection to enhancement is that you cannot enhance a soulbound item? So why can't you simply get the same stats on a tradeable item?

Either the soulbound item has stats that only soulbound items give, which as far as I am aware is not the case, or it must surely be possible to go out and grind until you get want you want, and enhance that. In which case I can see only one reason why you don't do that, which is that you don't want to have to grind over and over to get the item you want. The amusing thing being, that your proposal leaves everyone with no option other than to grind incessantly to gain the best items.
 
Characters
Tiffa, CyberElf
Platform
Android, PC
All I can Say on this topic is for everyone to go back to Playing Advanced Dungeons & Dragons, D&D Version 3.0 & 3.5 and Play by the origional rules.
Have fun because you will never get what you want, unless you are very lucky or adapt the rules to fix you and those who are playing with. I love the randomness of paper RPGs and prefer the true roll 3d6 for stats, because you can get some very bad or very good stats for your characters. I have had charecters with very poor stats become Epic while the reverse is also true, having great stats, and lots of starting money and get killed before acheaving level 10.
What I'm getting at is that it all how you play not your equipment, stats or Luck.
 

Kitty the Hunter

Villager
Platform
PC
All I can Say on this topic is for everyone to go back to Playing Advanced Dungeons & Dragons, D&D Version 3.0 & 3.5 and Play by the origional rules.
Have fun because you will never get what you want, unless you are very lucky or adapt the rules to fix you and those who are playing with. I love the randomness of paper RPGs and prefer the true roll 3d6 for stats, because you can get some very bad or very good stats for your characters. I have had charecters with very poor stats become Epic while the reverse is also true, having great stats, and lots of starting money and get killed before acheaving level 10.
What I'm getting at is that it all how you play not your equipment, stats or Luck.
I have played games in which when first making a character they came with random stats adjusted to the selected class. I'd reroll for quite awhile to get something decent. There are so many ways to develop a game, almost limitless. sorry if this is off topic.
 

Myst

Squirrel
Characters
Mystic Fox
Platform
PC
Last edited
How about if enhancements where an account type thing? Say one of your characters could enhance to level 75, they all could. If any one character had max enhance skills all of you characters could enhance to max level. It may be an easier way to do it than changing all the gear. You would still need at least one character with the skill to me able to enhance. This way alts would not need to live in a fully upgraded city to enhance.(As long as the one with the skills did).
I thought of this too but couldn't think how to explain it. Thank you!

Hmm, although maybe let the player willing to level skills on all characters get something extra per additional character... special recipe perhaps? Some benefit for doing extra leveling.
 
Reactions: Anthem
  • Likex1

Greenwich

Wizard
Platform
PC
How about if enhancements where an account type thing? Say one of your characters could enhance to level 75, they all could. If any one character had max enhance skills all of you characters could enhance to max level. It may be an easier way to do it than changing all the gear. You would still need at least one character with the skill to me able to enhance. This way alts would not need to live in a fully upgraded city to enhance.(As long as the one with the skills did).
This is a great idea of course.
Would certainly be one of the easiest ways to accomplish this.
 
Reactions: Kaydee
  • Likex1

Myst

Squirrel
Characters
Mystic Fox
Platform
PC
Ok, so just let me get this straight - your sole objection to enhancement is that you cannot enhance a soulbound item? So why can't you simply get the same stats on a tradeable item?

Either the soulbound item has stats that only soulbound items give, which as far as I am aware is not the case, or it must surely be possible to go out and grind until you get want you want, and enhance that. In which case I can see only one reason why you don't do that, which is that you don't want to have to grind over and over to get the item you want. The amusing thing being, that your proposal leaves everyone with no option other than to grind incessantly to gain the best items.
While I agree with you, alts without the crafting levels wouldn't have many reasons to run dungeons.
 

Greenwich

Wizard
Platform
PC
Ok, so just let me get this straight - your sole objection to enhancement is that you cannot enhance a soulbound item? So why can't you simply get the same stats on a tradeable item?
What if I can get those stats easier by going to dungeon? Or again, are dungeon items supposed to only good for runes? same for elder items?

In which case I can see only one reason why you don't do that, which is that you don't want to have to grind over and over to get the item you want. The amusing thing being, that your proposal leaves everyone with no option other than to grind incessantly to gain the best items.
I enjoy the combat grind, in fact I'd be happy I could get all my items from just combat without having to craft at all. But let us break this down a bit.

1.. My staff = calendar, it's the best I did not grind for it, it came from the calendar, it was soulbound, I enchanted it myself I had to, no other choice,
2.. My trinkets dungeon, because I have not found anything better yet in the wild. When is the last time you found a marshland epic trinket with the stats you prefer?
2. My gloves, Dungeon.
4. My neck, compensation soulbound
5. my rings compensation soulbound.
6. My chest crafted.
7. hat marshlands
8. spellbook. still blue amazingly chanted to epic. (this is how rare epic are in marshlands,
9 boots .. not sure

Now as you can see most of the items I have that are top tier were soulbound. I had to have the craft skills leveled to 90 to enhance them .
I have shamen, currently I cannot enhance any of my leveling gear. and you go through gear very quick. Enhancement is useless at the moment for him, unless I go ahead and do 2 craft skills once again all the way up to 90 just for the one purpose of enhancing gear on that character.
 
Characters
Tiffa, CyberElf
Platform
Android, PC
I have played games in which when first making a character they came with random stats adjusted to the selected class. I'd reroll for quite awhile to get something decent. There are so many ways to develop a game, almost limitless. sorry if this is off topic.
No Problem I was Off Topic myself ir just having Random numbers is just how games work if there is no randomness then there is no challange.
 

Rin

Citizen
Last edited
What if once a player was able to max all crafting skills, that player gets an ability to enhance (not necessarily 5/5, still depends on village of course) and that ability itself is account-bound?
Meaning, once you unlocked that ability in one toon, your other toons are free to enhance any gear level without their crafting catching up.
Then this ability is limited to all toons which are on the same server so it wouldn't be too much perk.

Anyway, side note... I read a thread from before where someone is suggesting there should be safe zones for gathering higher level materials for pure villagers. I guess this is in some way the other side of the coin.
In my opinion, (and please I hope no one gets offended, I'm not rejecting OP's views in any way, this is just my opinion and realization that I think, emphasis on I think, makes sense) the game is very feasible if one wants to play as pure villager or pure hero.
But for min/maxers and players who wants to be self-sufficient, it is only achievable by being a villager and a hero. Thus Villagers and Heroes! 🙌

But don't worry OP, I don't like crafting either, it's such a tedious work. I'm not against being able to enhance tho, but I agree it shouldn't be repeated in every toon.

EDIT: Nevermind, someone already suggested this above. I didn't read posts in pages 4-5 before I posted.
 

Erwalt

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Last I remember.. If I gnogment a soulbound item with a non-soulbound item. The non-soulbound item becomes soulbound.
No, it's the process of gnogmenting that binds your items. Gnoging 2 non-soulbound items will make a soulbound final product.
Which is what enhancing does, locks every character into having to level not 1 but 2 crafts, meaning you must level the same craft multiple times.. if you want your soulbound items enhanced on all characters.
Afaik you need only one craft.

Imo everyone should decide what is worth for him/her. If you do find enhancing makes you so much powerful, sure, go out and grind that skill, if not, well, then don't, it's a matter of choice in the end.
Imo enhancing shouldn't be removed. If one is playing only a portion of the game than he shouldn't have the access to everything. Lvling crafts on an alt is no different than lvling combat on alt.
 

Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
What if I can get those stats easier by going to dungeon? Or again, are dungeon items supposed to only good for runes? same for elder items?



I enjoy the combat grind, in fact I'd be happy I could get all my items from just combat without having to craft at all. But let us break this down a bit.

1.. My staff = calendar, it's the best I did not grind for it, it came from the calendar, it was soulbound, I enchanted it myself I had to, no other choice,
2.. My trinkets dungeon, because I have not found anything better yet in the wild. When is the last time you found a marshland epic trinket with the stats you prefer?
2. My gloves, Dungeon.
4. My neck, compensation soulbound
5. my rings compensation soulbound.
6. My chest crafted.
7. hat marshlands
8. spellbook. still blue amazingly chanted to epic. (this is how rare epic are in marshlands,
9 boots .. not sure

Now as you can see most of the items I have that are top tier were soulbound. I had to have the craft skills leveled to 90 to enhance them .
I have shamen, currently I cannot enhance any of my leveling gear. and you go through gear very quick. Enhancement is useless at the moment for him, unless I go ahead and do 2 craft skills once again all the way up to 90 just for the one purpose of enhancing gear on that character.
My emphasis

And there you have it folks - what OP actually wants is to obtain the very best gear in the game by the method which is easiest for them. They don't want to craft, they don't even want to have to grind mobs for the lower chance of the same item.

And for a comparison here's my water shaman (or at least her level gear at level 75 she is currently on the 75 rebirth). Just for background, her lowest skill is gardening at level 64, cooking at 70, woodcraft at 73 and ranching at 74. After that comes fishing 77, plant lore 79, Mining 80, smithing 80, tailor 81 and bug lore 83. She also has the armour specialisation. All gear is gnogged, therefore, soulbound, but what is list below is the original base item. All enhancements were done by her, all crafted gear was made by her, except the shield, given to me by a guildie who has the weapon specialisation.

1 Axe - crafted (ie tradeable) rare enhanced to epic status
2 Trinkets - monster drops (ie tradeable) 1 is rare, enhanced to epic status, the other uncommon enhanced to rare status.
3. Gloves - crafted (ie tradeable) epic enhanced to legendary status
4. Necklace - monster drop (ie tradeable) uncommon, enhanced to rare status
5. My rings - 1 monster drop lvl 73, (ie tradeable) uncommon enhanced to rare status, 1 quest item, level 64 (soulbound) uncommon enhanced to rare status
6. Main armour -crafted (ie tradeable) epic enhanced to legendary status
7. Hat - crafted (ie tradeable) epic enhanced to legendary status
8. Totem - monster drop (ie tradeable) uncommon, enhanced to rare status
9. Boots - crafted (ie tradeable) epic enhanced to legendary status
10. Belt - crafted (ie tradeable) epic enhanced to legendary status
11. Shield - crafted (ie tradeable) epic enhanced to legendary status (given by guildie)

Now, as you can see, ALL of my top tier items are crafted and enhanced, Why can I obtain legendary gear in this way? Because I took the time to level up crafts and gathers, spent tokens to get the specialisation, and earned the right to the gear.
Why do I NOT have legendary gear on necklaces, trinkets, rings and totems? Because despite the fact that ( as my fellow guildies can confirm) I have picked up every single drop that fell in 4 rebirths, those are the best I have got. It is true I have gained the odd epic from quests, and even about a dozen straight epic drops, but NONE of them had the stats that suit my intended build.

OP's suggestion removes my ability to gain the top tier by a reliable method which I have earned by levelling up crafting and earning a specialisation and reduces all my options to the level of the current state of trinkets, rings etc (which has left me for example still using a level 64 uncommon ring at level 75 because it is the best drop I've found).

And why do I get reduced to this endless grind in hopes of improved gear? Why, because getting legendary items from dungeon drops would (in the OP's own words) allow them to "get those stats easier by going to dungeon".

I rest my case.
 

Greenwich

Wizard
Platform
PC
Lvling crafts on an alt is no different than lvling combat on alt.
But it is different, are you leveling 2 holy priests, oir are you leveling different classes, or different skills at least?
Are you required to have a holy priest on every character in order to craft a lev 90 holy mace?
 

Greenwich

Wizard
Platform
PC
My emphasis

And there you have it folks - what OP actually wants is to obtain the very best gear in the game by the method which is easiest for them. They don't want to craft, they don't even want to have to grind mobs for the lower chance of the same item.
And there you have it folks, the poster refuses to acknowledge what I have written, and twist it up to for the single purpose of claiming that I refuse to craft. When that is completely false.
And you are saying.. 'I don't even want to have to grind mobs for the lower chance of the same item'.?
I'm not the guy who put dungeon drops in the game. But since they exist.. do I have the right to state my opinion that dungeon drops should be enhanceable by anyone on my account? or enhance should be removed and those items should already be top tier so I don't have to max the same craft on all characters?

Why not try simply disagreeing with my suggestion.. or even say why my suggestion is bad for the system itself.. instead of trying to claim how my choice to enjoy the game is a problem for you and the rest of the community?

OP's suggestion removes my ability to gain the top tier by a reliable method which I have earned by levelling up crafting and earning a specialisation and reduces all my options to the level of the current state of trinkets, rings etc (which has left me for example still using a level 64 uncommon ring at level 75 because it is the best drop I've found).
And you ignore my proposal once again. It removes everyone's ability to enhance, it does not remove your ability to take advantage of specialization. It does not take away, and in fact gives you the ability to craft top tier items without them needing to be enhanced. And in fact the trinket that you are worried about is already 5/5? and if it is not it could simply be made 5/5 in the without the 5/5 name.. a tier up.
Your uncommon ring would be a rare. So no it does not remove your ability to gain top tier, in fact it gives you the ability to obtain top tier, But let us not forget the other possibilities that have been mentioned in this thread, Like rendering some things from soulbound to account bound. A solution that I should have mentioned myself. Or the feature itself being unlocked account wide. I am open to suggestion also.

And why do I get reduced to this endless grind in hopes of improved gear? Why, because getting legendary items from dungeon drops would (in the OP's own words) allow them to "get those stats easier by going to dungeon".
I rest my case.
And why do you assume you now have to grind more for improved gear?
Are you being sarcastic? please elaborate.. I can handle sarcasm just fine. I just don't understand what you are claiming here.
We can already get the best gear in dungeon (not including legendary gifts), what would be the difference?
 
Characters
Tiffa, CyberElf
Platform
Android, PC
And there you have it folks, the poster refuses to acknowledge what I have written, and twist it up to for the single purpose of claiming that I refuse to craft. When that is completely false.
And you are saying.. 'I don't even want to have to grind mobs for the lower chance of the same item'.?
I'm not the guy who put dungeon drops in the game. But since they exist.. do I have the right to state my opinion that dungeon drops should be enhanceable by anyone on my account? or enhance should be removed and those items should already be top tier so I don't have to max the same craft on all characters?

Why not try simply disagreeing with my suggestion.. or even say why my suggestion is bad for the system itself.. instead of trying to claim how my choice to enjoy the game is a problem for you and the rest of the community?


And you ignore my proposal once again. It removes everyone's ability to enhance, it does not remove your ability to take advantage of specialization. It does not take away, and in fact gives you the ability to craft top tier items without them needing to be enhanced. And in fact the trinket that you are worried about is already 5/5? and if it is not it could simply be made 5/5 in the without the 5/5 name.. a tier up.
Your uncommon ring would be a rare. So no it does not remove your ability to gain top tier, in fact it gives you the ability to obtain top tier, But let us not forget the other possibilities that have been mentioned in this thread, Like rendering some things from soulbound to account bound. A solution that I should have mentioned myself. Or the feature itself being unlocked account wide. I am open to suggestion also.


And why do you assume you now have to grind more for improved gear?
Are you being sarcastic? please elaborate.. I can handle sarcasm just fine. I just don't understand what you are claiming here.
We can already get the best gear in dungeon (not including legendary gifts), what would be the difference?
You just want the best stuff for no work, but that is not how any game works unless it is pay to win. So my suggestion to you is to just quit V&H and find yourself a nice and easy pay to win game where you can get what you want, and leave those of us who are happy with the game to play as we like.
 

Erwalt

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
If you are really trying to min-max with a minimal effort you'll have to max woodcrafting anyway, to get the trinket runes, and that will unlock your enhancing. Or, don't bother at all and have your gear without enhancements, no one will notice, bounties will die in a couple of hits anyway.
We can already get the best gear in dungeon
Here I disagree, have never got a single useful item in dungeons, but ok, that's just my bad luck I guess. My gear is crafted, as that way I have a complete control over the stats.
 
Reactions: Kaydee
  • Likex1

Greenwich

Wizard
Platform
PC
You just want the best stuff for no work, but that is not how any game works unless it is pay to win. So my suggestion to you is to just quit V&H and find yourself a nice and easy pay to win game where you can get what you want, and leave those of us who are happy with the game to play as we like.
I am actually completely against pay to win games, this is one of the few pay to win games that I choose to play.
But I disagree that I want things easy, I do not. I am completely fine with grinding a craft, combat whatever.. make it harder make it ridiculously hard. But why force me to level the same skills multiple times? That's not hard, that is what I like to call... boring.
 
Top