Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
Can't speak to either grave bolt, or Dungeons, but retreat certainly was resisted - in Pyrron for example certain mobs had a 100% resist of retreat (and I assume mind spark, though I can't guarantee that since I never used it on my wiz). It was part of the tactics. But the mobs which resisted were ones that had relatively low health, so you used retreat to calm the mobs that didn't resist,then killed the ones that did resist first, then the bounty.

Maybe dungeon is the same, is it perhaps specific mobs which resist?

I confess I also thought the situation in regards to single pull prior to this latest change was slightly ridiculous, given that my squishy glass cannon chars got mobbed and my armour plated tank and bullet proof glass cannon priest didn't.

(Then again, one of the things that I dislike intensely about starfall is that it is next to impossible to build a true glass cannon anymore anyway.)
 

Ekimie

Hunter
Royal Guardian
Platform
Steam
Can't speak to either grave bolt, or Dungeons, but retreat certainly was resisted - in Pyrron for example certain mobs had a 100% resist of retreat (and I assume mind spark, though I can't guarantee that since I never used it on my wiz). It was part of the tactics. But the mobs which resisted were ones that had relatively low health, so you used retreat to calm the mobs that didn't resist,then killed the ones that did resist first, then the bounty.

Maybe dungeon is the same, is it perhaps specific mobs which resist?

I confess I also thought the situation in regards to single pull prior to this latest change was slightly ridiculous, given that my squishy glass cannon chars got mobbed and my armour plated tank and bullet proof glass cannon priest didn't.

(Then again, one of the things that I dislike intensely about starfall is that it is next to impossible to build a true glass cannon anymore anyway.)
I like to think I was a good hunter before starfall, with retreat. After starfall I never quite 'got' it again, I am just improvizing all the way. I miss my retreat so much!
 

Sinjin

Jack Of All Trades
Platform
iOS
Mind spark and retreat were not used for pulling before the update (I think that was changed with Starfall update) they do other things.
This is incorrect. With MindSpark, Wiz could cast it within range of a group of mobs and pull singles so long as it was not resisted. It functioned like a pbaoe mez.
 
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Sinjin

Jack Of All Trades
Platform
iOS
Can't speak to either grave bolt, or Dungeons, but retreat certainly was resisted - in Pyrron for example certain mobs had a 100% resist of retreat (and I assume mind spark, though I can't guarantee that since I never used it on my wiz). It was part of the tactics. But the mobs which resisted were ones that had relatively low health, so you used retreat to calm the mobs that didn't resist,then killed the ones that did resist first, then the bounty.
This sounds like you’re describing a group of soul-linked mobs. They all come as one (single pull skill or not, they are all linked), but they have less hp and are easy to aoe.
 

Lightentity

Great Adventurer
Characters
Lightentity and Darkfin
Platform
Android, PC
This is incorrect. With MindSpark, Wiz could cast it within range of a group of mobs and pull singles so long as it was not resisted. It functioned like a pbaoe mez.
I know about that, wasn't this before Starfall?
I wrote my comment wrongly. As far as I know, mind spark and retreat only functioned as deaggro feats before Starfall(I remember using them myself in fact).
 

Sinjin

Jack Of All Trades
Platform
iOS
No, MindSpark was changed last week. It’s now something completely different (and doesn’t work for ice wiz at all).

Hunter’s ‘Retreat’ may have been a Starfall thing though... never played a hunter, so couldn’t say.

Edit:typos
 
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Lightentity

Great Adventurer
Characters
Lightentity and Darkfin
Platform
Android, PC
No, MindSpark was changed last week. It’s now something completely different (and doesn’t work for ice wiz at all).

Hunter’s ‘Retreat’ may have been a Starfall thing though... never played a hunter, so couldn’t say.

Edit:typos
Well I only started playing a fire wiz not to long ago, and haven't come across any groups, (because I changed my 40s ice wiz to fire) so I didn't realize mind spark ever worked that way(never heard of it either).
 

dustbunny

Squirrel
Platform
iOS, PC
Well I only started playing a fire wiz not to long ago, and haven't come across any groups, (because I changed my 40s ice wiz to fire) so I didn't realize mind spark ever worked that way(never heard of it either).
This is very true, these changes will not have any effect on new players, but it is once again the older toons/players who feel the changes. I miss condemn on my priest. Mind spark I don't so much as I rarely used it to pull mobs. Have not tried hunter without retreat as I am so frustrate by not having condemn on priest I really don't want to run my hunter right now and be frustrated with two toons. Especially since both would run zones with mass agro. Added to the inability to pull single mobs is the added new feats/spells that will attack multiple mobs at one time while you have no control what so ever as to when this occurs. I know more and more players who will not use blasting or put points all the way into the ultimates because of the inability to control when they go off. This is murderous in dungeons where kill the mobs before the bounty has a grave effect on the players and the run time. I am feeling the push to having to group run in this game and solo runners are getting forgotten.
 

Caly

BRA Member
Characters
Caly Adaria Chrysis & 2 others
Platform
PC
Hmm,pretty sure Lignhing Bolt could be resisted too....

Honestly,that Grave Bolt can be resisted seems normal to me.
I play lightening warrior and I did have mine resisted more then once. I always just assumed it was a game mechanic and while it causes issues it also causes random omg how am I gonna deal with this fun. That's just my opinion though.
 

Caly

BRA Member
Characters
Caly Adaria Chrysis & 2 others
Platform
PC
This is very true, these changes will not have any effect on new players, but it is once again the older toons/players who feel the changes. I miss condemn on my priest. Mind spark I don't so much as I rarely used it to pull mobs. Have not tried hunter without retreat as I am so frustrate by not having condemn on priest I really don't want to run my hunter right now and be frustrated with two toons. Especially since both would run zones with mass agro. Added to the inability to pull single mobs is the added new feats/spells that will attack multiple mobs at one time while you have no control what so ever as to when this occurs. I know more and more players who will not use blasting or put points all the way into the ultimates because of the inability to control when they go off. This is murderous in dungeons where kill the mobs before the bounty has a grave effect on the players and the run time. I am feeling the push to having to group run in this game and solo runners are getting forgotten.
I'm mainly a solo runner and I too am feeling that push of being forced into groups or not play at all. I'm not a very outgoing person so group play doesn't go well for me.
 

Zazie

BRA Member
Royal Guardian
Characters
Zazie, Shiny, Skip, Auntie
Platform
PC
I'm mainly a solo runner and I too am feeling that push of being forced into groups or not play at all. I'm not a very outgoing person so group play doesn't go well for me.
I'm mostly a solo player too, and while I can be very social, I don't necessarily feel any desire to combine being social with combat. Not for ordinary zones, at least. To me, that's what event zones and elder runs are for. Running ordinary zones solo is "me time," when I don't watch and participate in chat (as I do while gathering and crafting) and can do everything on my own schedule, on my own terms, and can run as many zones or as few zones (or even as few bounties within a zone) as I choose.

Even if you're only running with one other person, either they're always waiting for you or you're always waiting for them! (Usually in my case, they're always waiting for me!) LOL It's so much simpler when you can just solo ordinary zones without having to worry about schedules, whether bounties have reset, when they will reset, who needs what loot, when you need to stop to get to a vault or empty your bags, or what-have-you.....
 

Caly

BRA Member
Characters
Caly Adaria Chrysis & 2 others
Platform
PC
I'm mostly a solo player too, and while I can be very social, I don't necessarily feel any desire to combine being social with combat. Not for ordinary zones, at least. To me, that's what event zones and elder runs are for. Running ordinary zones solo is "me time," when I don't watch and participate in chat (as I do while gathering and crafting) and can do everything on my own schedule, on my own terms, and can run as many zones or as few zones (or even as few bounties within a zone) as I choose.

Even if you're only running with one other person, either they're always waiting for you or you're always waiting for them! (Usually in my case, they're always waiting for me!) LOL It's so much simpler when you can just solo ordinary zones without having to worry about schedules, whether bounties have reset, when they will reset, who needs what loot, when you need to stop to get to a vault or empty your bags, or what-have-you.....
Lol I never watch chat. Except guild. Only time I play with others is elders lol. I do run with my other half but of course with him I don't have to stress over anything anyway although he doesn't play as much as I do.
 

Megalomaniac

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Characters
Megalomaniac, Enya, KatKat
Platform
PC
Last edited
(Lightening warrior): I've been trying out grave bolt. Not impressed enough to permanently replace charge with it, the only slot where it would make sense since it starts the battle. But the trinkets that carry it often have nice stats. I would prefer they return condemn to the priests over offering everyone the chance to simulate condemn and lightening bolt with grave bolt - we knew where things stood in places like Maldwyn's Tomb with one class (priest) doing the pull. And the item seems to be removing threat from the tank and giving it to the DPS, which gets characters killed in ladder. The latest class balance in general has me a bit confused... I'm not sure if Vessia in event zone thinks I'm not equipped with my shield or if it's true the holy priests' mass heals were very nerfed.
 
Platform
PC
I can see what you mean here, but lightning bolt and condemn had other attributes as well that made them worthwhile. Lightning bolt dealt damage and generated threat while condemn applied a debuff. In those cases I could see justification as to why a pull could resist from time to time.

Grave bolt on the other hand is designed with one purpose only, and that is to pull enemies. With that in mind I don't see a valid reason as to why it could fail. None of my other trinket spells have a chance of failure
To play devil's advocate on your last statement. For all other trinket runes - don't they all affect YOU and not the mob? <I can't think of another trinket that affects the enemy.> If I'm right and there isn't another one, then trying to compare this spell to others would be comparing apples and oranges.

Mind you, as I said - I agree with you. As it stands now with the rarity of the item, AND the very long cooldown, I think that it should not be resisted. If devs feel otherwise, they should make the item more common and shorten the cooldown.
 

Majenta

Villager
Forum Moderator
Platform
PC
A guildie and I were running a few zones with our Shaman chars yesterday, and in under 3 hours picked up six trinkets with the grave bolt rune.

Rackabone Cave and Hogfish Mine if anyone wants to try their luck. (Both of those zones provided two of the trinkets.)
 
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SKAAVVEEK

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Characters
See Signature
Platform
PC
The wording on the spell itself has no indication that it can be resisted:
3017
In fact it is so strongly worded "force the target to engage in solo battle, blocking the enemy's ability to call for aid." that it seems more of an oversight than an actual feature. If the chance of resistance is actually intended, then it should clearly be stated on the spell description: "Has a chance to force..."
 

Zeph

Adventurer
Characters
Zephyr Arya
Platform
PC
Although it does say *IF* rather than *When* so maybe it doesn't always initiate combat! Tho I think it should and so far it has for me.
 

Diet

Mad Otter Games
Developer
It is intentional that grave bolt can be resisted. Just like all debuffs (stuns, freezes, reduced damage debuffs etc), enemies have a chance to resist a negative effect. In this case the negative effect is being forced to do combat without calling its allies for help. And just like all debuffs, certain enemies have more or less protection towards resisting the effect. Grave Bolt is considered a "Control" effect, since it is controlling the behavior of an enemy. Monsters in dungeons have very high Control resistance, but normal mobs in Pyrron (for example) do not.
 

XMerlindaX

Wizard
Royal Guardian
Characters
Miss Marple, Matricia, Cherryl
Platform
PC
that with the resistance is ok too, but why the long cooldown?
 
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SKAAVVEEK

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Characters
See Signature
Platform
PC
Although it does say *IF* rather than *When* so maybe it doesn't always initiate combat! Tho I think it should and so far it has for me.
No, that just means if it is used as the first ability.
 
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