Adricade

Priest
Characters
Ralthobel
Platform
Android, PC
Last edited
I wanted to make this thread because I have seen a pattern in new potential players' minds that I wanted to discuss.

So in most of my videos that I am creating to support the game and the devs I see that most of the comments express concerns.
Preconceived notions that the game is dead, dying or barren wasteland that so many believe.
And even though I tried to cover that topic in my first video explaining to everyone that this is nonsense this gives me the following data.

Checking my statistics and analytics on my videos I can tell you what I found.
So most players are comparing the game to other games which is all fine.. I mean everyone compares..
But the root cause of them NOT playing it is because they pop up the game, log in the starting zone, they see noone and they log out.
I get questions like these and I tell them NOT to check Steam charts because the data there (I THINK) is not correct given that most players have downloaded the SAC client.
That number on Steam is scaring them from checking the game. Furthermore most of you are at endgame with all characters maxed out!
As the brave defender I am I absolutely believe that the new expansion is exactly what will turn the tide for them because of the new starting areas.
Not only that but just the revamped visuals, new systems, colorful items on the webpage that were placed by the devs is enough.

A Tale of Earth and Sea, I think is exactly the thing to shut them up and we will see a spike in the playerbase for sure.
The revamped starting zones, visuals and stuff will surely be enough to bring to their attention that the game has developed immensely over the course of the years.

I don't know I was just furious to see how they are comparing some titles that have those electric color hairs, flapping weird toys around the character and whatnot...
Most of them think that there is not much to do in the game just killing mobs, doing quests and that's it.
Perhaps if all the systems are showcased on the official webpage that will be enough as a marketing strategy don't know.

I was just a bit annoyed from all that and decided to vent here.. sorry for that rant but I think I'll just make a RANT VIDEO who knows :D hahaha

EDIT: And here is my video that I created having a discussion about the topics at hand -
 

Dawnfire

Great Adventurer
Characters
Athon Stormborne
Platform
Android, PC
I get questions like these and I tell them NOT to check Steam charts because the data there (I THINK) is not correct given that most players have downloaded the SAC client.
True, also android/iOS players are not represented there.

But the root cause of them NOT playing it is because they pop up the game, log in the starting zone, they see noone and they log out.
Interesting. While I don't spend much time in the starting zones anymore, everytime I rebirthed or started a new character I always saw other people too (mind you this is EU1, might be different elsewhere) in the starter zones. I do believe as well that a new class will surely make many people start anew and we'll see even more players there :)
 
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Zeph

Adventurer
Characters
Zephyr Arya
Platform
PC
I have always seen people in the starter zone when rebirthing, also I have heard, apart from new Shaman class, some older players will rebirth existing toons ( if they haven't already) knowing there will be others playing at their level.
 

Adricade

Priest
Characters
Ralthobel
Platform
Android, PC
I see some players yeah but even in reddit there are people saying that it feels empty. I can't wait for the new expansion so everyone can enjoy the new zones!
 

Karma

BRA Member
Characters
Instant Karma, Boot II
Platform
Steam
I wanted to make this thread because I have seen a pattern in new potential players' minds that I wanted to discuss.

So in most of my videos that I am creating to support the game and the devs I see that most of the comments express concerns.
Preconceived notions that the game is dead, dying or barren wasteland that so many believe.
Nice to see this topic addressed. I have also noted that many of the new players get the impression the game is dead.

Checking my statistics and analytics on my videos I can tell you what I found.
So most players are comparing the game to other games which is all fine.. I mean everyone compares..
But the root cause of them NOT playing it is because they pop up the game, log in the starting zone, they see noone and they log out.
Yes, often times they don't see anyone and log right out.

I get questions like these and I tell them NOT to check Steam charts because the data there (I THINK) is not correct given that most players have downloaded the SAC client.
That number on Steam is scaring them from checking the game.
If the number on Steam is scaring them, IMO its because they do not interpret the Steam Charts correctly.
As of 20 minutes ago (of this writing) there were 77 player actually playing V&H.
IMO not bad for a game where the majority of the players are SAC client and mobile players.
Also IMO a small indie company like this one will never be able to compete on the same level as the big powerhouse MMO publishers.

I think the biggest turnoff for new players is world chat.
They start the game and see chat is silent. Especially if they log in during non-prime hours.
I most other MMO games world chat is always busy. So they jump to the conclusion the game is dead.

I'm not sure how we can improve the first impressions of new players.
Perhaps impress on them the community and how this Indie company responds to the players.

Best regards
 

Adricade

Priest
Characters
Ralthobel
Platform
Android, PC
No idea as well... I am trying my best to advertise the game the best I can but I do not have that many viewers yet to see all the pros...
Most are not even trying the game because of the lack of PVP...
I still believe that A Tale of Earth and Sea will blow up so.. let's wait and see :)
 
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Xloui

Villager
Characters
Aloui Bloui Cloui
Platform
iOS
Hi :)
If chat is the problem, and we are many mobile players, someone should look hard at how chat works on mobile. I use ios/ipad and chat takes over the whole screen, and when I want to write the keyboard takes half the screen where the new replies are. So in practice I write blind. Iow on mobile I do not chat. I log on to pc only for that. If mobile chat was better, I would chat more. Maybe it’s not only me?
Hope is a precious thing, I have to spare :D
 

Zazie

BRA Member
Royal Guardian
Characters
Zazie, Shiny, Skip, Auntie
Platform
PC
The upcoming Earth and Sea expansion will have improvements to the chat UI for mobile players! :D https://villagers-and-heroes.com/earthandsea/

I recall seeing a preview of it on a Twitch livestream, but I can't remember which dev showed it, which month that livestream happened in, and have no clue of whether it's still in the archives. :p
 
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Xloui

Villager
Characters
Aloui Bloui Cloui
Platform
iOS
:):):) That’s marvelous and wonderful and really, really happiness-making nice. :D:D:D
 

Adricade

Priest
Characters
Ralthobel
Platform
Android, PC
Yes there are a lot of improvements that I am looking forward to! Honestly, I can't wait for the release date already uuugh
 

Visch

Squirrel
Platform
Android
I'll be honest i already quit the game after only logging a few weeks on the game and here is a few personal reasons why;
1)From research the endgame of this game is nothing like any of the other core games out there with raids, battlegrounds, etc..which is a huge turn off when I want my hard earned gear to have a great purpose.
2) Many high level players have expressed to me that the amount of delay between skills is unbearable, especially in big groups..I tried for myself and totally agree. It's hard to choose this sort of style of slow reaction mechanics when theres so many more games out there that offer faster, smoother and cleaner combat.
3) no pvp. I understand many people believe pvp will bring a bunch of sour people, but thats not true. Pvp could enrich this game, bring a bigger community and add various new types of game play for existing and new players to enjoy. I mean, even a separate pvp server could make this game shine and keep the non pvp folk away from pvp folk.
4) The population is small, there's no argument to that. When I created my toons, every single one of them had spotted maybe one or two people within the starting town. Even in Ardent city there was maybe 10 people.
5) rebirth is an awful mechanic. It makes you replay the game several times, but doesn't change anything up in terms of quest or anything else.

so many more things I could add but that would take too long. I think this game has much potential and i'll come back to try once the expansions out but until then there's nothing here to keep my interest up enough to play.

Mobile is awesome, but it's only good until you realize how small of a world this game truly is and that it feels more like a single player game then anything else. I'm playing osrs till the expansions out ;o
 

Giruv

Merchant
Characters
Verrier
Platform
PC
I'll be honest i already quit the game after only logging a few weeks on the game and here is a few personal reasons why;
1)From research the endgame of this game is nothing like any of the other core games out there with raids, battlegrounds, etc..which is a huge turn off when I want my hard earned gear to have a great purpose.
2) Many high level players have expressed to me that the amount of delay between skills is unbearable, especially in big groups..I tried for myself and totally agree. It's hard to choose this sort of style of slow reaction mechanics when theres so many more games out there that offer faster, smoother and cleaner combat.
3) no pvp. I understand many people believe pvp will bring a bunch of sour people, but thats not true. Pvp could enrich this game, bring a bigger community and add various new types of game play for existing and new players to enjoy. I mean, even a separate pvp server could make this game shine and keep the non pvp folk away from pvp folk.
4) The population is small, there's no argument to that. When I created my toons, every single one of them had spotted maybe one or two people within the starting town. Even in Ardent city there was maybe 10 people.
5) rebirth is an awful mechanic. It makes you replay the game several times, but doesn't change anything up in terms of quest or anything else.

1. I agree with this but considering the player base i'm not sure whether it will work out or not, the dungeon addition was pretty nice at the start, but after some iteration i don't really like it anymore because it become stale and slow. The first few patches just increase mob hp and lower their damage, and then nerf player damages

2. After the last python update and moving to different server base, it become significantly better, the ping, latency, even fps increased a little especially for those that use older machine. I agree the combat, stats, talent, leveling curve and crafting system need an overhaul. The sense of freedom and achievement need to be added

3. I have mixed feeling about this one, pvp is really good to make game less boring and give variation to combat, because each fight can be different, no matter how good a pve is after a while you'll figure out the fight pattern and can exploit it, and make every fight almost the same. But because of how the combat system we have now i don't want a pvp to be added especially a direct combat one or player killing system. A good pvp need a good combat system, purposes, and penalty and reward system which the game don't have right now, so adding a pvp now won't be good at all even for those that want it.

But the game do need something that PvP bring, a sense of competition. It can make the time spend on grinding, building your character, and just spending time in game more worth it and sadly the easiest way I can think of is PvP. If PvP would be added i hope it's something not direct, may be a race to complete some objectives, survival contest, or any other thing along that path. A crafting and gathering PvP could be fun too, where there is objective given out to bring certain items and the team that can finish the highest amount of objective win. Also something that i enjoy from another game is PvP don't have to always exist it can be seasonal like an event zone

4. I agree the population is small, but it's not small to the point of dying game yet, in my opinion there are just too few things to do that make people want to hang out at the same place like ardent city for a longer time, may be checking AH once in a while, to charter vendor, to red doubloon vendor and that's it, that make places look empty. The same happen to any other zone there is nothing special that make you want to stay at the same zone for extended period of time

5. I don't mind if rebirth exist or not because it's not necessary and i think this is what need to be emphasized, because most player rebirth straight away get bored and left, i've played for more than 2 years, out of all toons i have i only have rebirthed one of them and haven't reach the 5 rebirth mark. I think they're still comparable to those that have rebirthed 5 times.

so many more things I could add but that would take too long. I think this game has much potential and i'll come back to try once the expansions out but until then there's nothing here to keep my interest up enough to play.

Mobile is awesome, but it's only good until you realize how small of a world this game truly is and that it feels more like a single player game then anything else. I'm playing osrs till the expansions out ;o
I agree with you this game definitely have the potential and that's why i'm sticking to it
 

Visch

Squirrel
Platform
Android
Kudo to you guys who have the patience to stay and support the devs financially and keep the servers with some people in them, without that the game would die. Hopeful this expansion comes out sooner than we expect.
 

Ekimie

Hunter
Royal Guardian
Platform
Steam
Kudo to you guys who have the patience to stay and support the devs financially and keep the servers with some people in them, without that the game would die. Hopeful this expansion comes out sooner than we expect.
Some might argue that is no effort at all, because we simply like to be here and play. It is not so much a time to survive as a time in which to play and anticipate the upcoming new class and improvements, while discussing these and our hopes for the expansion with eachother.
 

WarEdge

Mighty Warrior
Platform
PC
For me, I been playing this game for 4 years and still going. Im really looking forward for the expansion packs. So many things I want to do on day 1, Im going to need bigger coffee mug to do it :))) I want to run the new 90 zone then new dungeon then event zone then village projects then shaman then then then :)) u get the point :)

PvP…..I almost feel like every single pvp game I played, there always chance of it being nasty and toxic. There has been some good pvp that both people were happy even when one lost but many I seen toxic that will make u cry or worst :(. I love the idea of team pvp where u have to complete challenges and not fight each other in duel :)
 

SKAAVVEEK

Adventurer
Royal Guardian
Characters
See Signature
Platform
PC
I'll be honest i already quit the game after only logging a few weeks on the game and here is a few personal reasons why;
I'm glad you provided feedback, it is very important to know why players leave the game.

1)From research the endgame of this game is nothing like any of the other core games out there with raids, battlegrounds, etc..which is a huge turn off when I want my hard earned gear to have a great purpose.
There is a single dungeon, which does not constitute as end-game due to the fact that it is open to pretty much all players. I agree that end-game is vital for the longevity of any MMO. I have tried to promote the idea but the focus seems to be on yearly level cap raises instead - for the fraction of capped players that are left at the time.

2) Many high level players have expressed to me that the amount of delay between skills is unbearable, especially in big groups..I tried for myself and totally agree. It's hard to choose this sort of style of slow reaction mechanics when theres so many more games out there that offer faster, smoother and cleaner combat.
This has been largely resolved for myself and others with the recent update.

3) no pvp. I understand many people believe pvp will bring a bunch of sour people, but thats not true. Pvp could enrich this game, bring a bigger community and add various new types of game play for existing and new players to enjoy. I mean, even a separate pvp server could make this game shine and keep the non pvp folk away from pvp folk.
I don't agree with those who claim that PvP will create a toxic environment that will somehow spoil the V&H community. That being said, I also don't think PvP has a place here simply due to time and balancing reasons. It is a very challenging endeavour, and could prove fruitless as others titles are focused entirely on PvP and their combat system and mechanics revolve around it. V&H would not seem as enticing in comparison.

For those seeking the competitive type game-play, there are plenty of other avenues to explore. For example, Village vs Village, which tasks villagers with creating dungeons and attempting to conquer each others dungeons. It's a PvE mode, and yet creates some of that friendly rivalry for those who opt in.

Leaderboards for dungeons are another option. Allow players to strive to reach the top in damage, healing or time. Races, obstacle courses... I'm sure there are plenty of other competitive modes that do not involve direct player vs player combat.

4) The population is small, there's no argument to that. When I created my toons, every single one of them had spotted maybe one or two people within the starting town. Even in Ardent city there was maybe 10 people.
This is mostly due to the outdated bounty system. Players go in a zone, spend 15 minutes killing bounties, and leave.
 
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Baldaryche

Priest
Platform
Android, PC
Ardricade,
I'm a new player, been playing a month and a half. At first, I was somewhat intimidated by the game, and was because I didn't understand the gameplay. I would login and collect daily reward and log out. But, what I did was searched for answers on the game. After finding and reading the wiki, I got a better grasp on gameplay. That being said, I think a suggestion for new players would be to read the new player part of the wiki.

Man I'm ever so grateful that I read the wiki. My God I never dreamed V & H had sooo much going on. V & H has me hook, line and sinker. With Main quests, side quests, gathering, crafting, Elder weapons and armor, Zogs, mounts, ranching and planting crops and Villages(with or without a guild). Not forgetting there are dungeons(can only bide my time to reach lvl 30 - that's what I gathered from world/all chat - or the story quest line is). Oh and rebirthing. I'm sure there is more to discover.

Moving forward, I am now a lvl 20 Priest. Made my first two pieces of Elder Armor and Mace. Completed the Miscreant and The Four Guards portion of quests. Now forging forward to find the the Thrush.

The other thing I want to mention is, the player community is awesome. People are friendly and helpful.

Sincerely,
 

Adricade

Priest
Characters
Ralthobel
Platform
Android, PC
@Visch - I agree with everything you said! I believe that the game needs to focus more on providing endgame content and putting in front ALL systems available in the game. Players are not aware of what there is to do in the game and once they find out that what they want is not there to begin with, it turns them off and they leave. If there are more dungeons, more endgame content in general, PVP and other systems that draw the players in the game will just explode! I mean people are telling me that AQ3D is better ... I tried it.. I didn't like it I left. It's bland, it's cheap for me and I do not see myself playing it. But at the same time AQ3D has a lot more players just because of the pvp coming and lots of different systems to tackle. The game is trying to be good everywhere instead of having 1 thing that separates it from other games in the market. Anyway I think V&H will blow up if they add more endgame content and PVP. Regardless what people here think that it will make it worse, as a person who graduated with Gaming and Animation I can totally say that they are wrong. I was analyzing markets before and this will just totally redevelop the whole game and bring in masses!

@Ekimie - I can't wait for the expansion as well! If they just switch their focus on more stuff to do during leveling and endgame content with the new expansion I will be extremely happy!

@Kitty the Hunter - Some of those games can't even compare to V&H... hands down!

@SKAAVVEEK - Competition is exactly what this game needs! This is just a common knowledge in gaming, wherever there is no competition people will leave. Some here say that PVE is the only competition you need but I disagree. There is a reason why leveling is done by killing mobs and doing quests, earning gear etc. You need that gear but for what? There is not enough endgame content aparently, and if another stat is introduced improving PVP mastery for example that will create further market in the game where players will focus more on crafting powerful PVP items, economy will flourish etc. so many pros! I believe all this way outweighs the cons of introducing these...

@Baldaryche - Welcome to the game! Hope you enjoy it and I invite you to watch my videos as I continue introducing content for new players through my journey to engame. You may find something you like. All the Best!
 
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